“God Bless You”

An Interview with Honor Guardsman Patrick Cubbage and His Wife Barbara
By Stephen Lesser

Earlier this year, The Rutherford Institute took up the case of Patrick Cubbage, a Vietnam combat veteran, who was fired from his job as a military honor guardsman for saying “God bless you” to families during funeral ceremonies. The case garnered widespread media attention due to the seemingly incredible position of Cubbage’s superiors, who insisted that mentioning God in funeral services was offensive. Even after Cubbage demonstrated conclusively that the phrase “God bless you and this family, and God bless the United States of America” was officially endorsed by the military’s Flag Presentation Protocol, he was ordered to cease using the blessing, and was fired when he offered it during a ceremony at a family’s request.

Last week, attorneys for The Rutherford Institute finalized a settlement with the New Jersey Department of Military and Veterans' Affairs, securing restitution for 10 months of lost wages as well as his reinstatement as an honor guardsman. The terms of the agreement also ensure that honor guardsmen can say “God Bless You” whenever families request it. Rutherford Institute President, John W. Whitehead, called the settlement “precedent-setting,” noting that in the future, families of the deceased must be asked if they prefer a religious service.

Patrick and Barbara Cubbage spoke with The Rutherford Institute recently, and expounded on their peculiar ordeal.

TRI: What led you to become a part-time honor guardsman at the veterans’ memorial cemetery in North Hanover, N.J.?

Patrick Cubbage: Well, it all goes back to March of 1997, when my youngest son asked me if I would salute him because he was becoming a commissioned officer. I had been out of the military for 18 years, but I had a friend at a Christian company who was a recruiter. With a little help, I was able to get my rank back and salute my son when he was commissioned. In 2000, I was an active member of the New Jersey National Guard, and the company I was working for was down-sizing and I got laid-off. The New Jersey National Guard called me up and said they had positions open for special work. I worked in recruiting, organizing parades and I finally got assigned to the emergency operations center, which entailed being the liaison between all of the military, federal, state and local law enforcement agencies and civilians. They handle any type of disaster, military cemeteries, as thousands of veterans are dying each day that were in World War II. I would handle that and would get honor guards for them. During the course of working there, we started being short a number of times, so I volunteered to do it one time. Then, I said I was honored to support the families of veterans who had supported us. So, I did it a few more times.

While working at the emergency operations center, I was involved with the aftermath of the terrorist attacks on September 11, 2001. The majority of the staff, over 95%, was away at anti-terrorist training in Colorado, California and Canada. When it hit, I was the number two person to find out what was going on. I was involved in getting the 108th air squadron up in the air that went over New York, and I helped in getting the entire east coast military online with all of the law enforcement agencies. The following Friday, I was scheduled to go away for a two-week training session, but when I came back, my position was filled by 60 or 70 officers. It was packed. You could not get in the room, so they did not have a position for me there anymore. About a week or two later, the supervisor of the cemetery called me at home and asked if I’d work with them on a part-time/full-time basis. I discussed it with my wife and I went over as their part-time/full-timer, working there for well over a year.

Then there was a change in state government. Another supervisor came in and another CEO, still following policies. But then they decided to change the policies, because a couple of the honor guards did not want to say “God bless you.”

How did it make you feel when you were told to stop referring to God while participating in graveside presentations?

PC: Well, it was unreal. Shock set in, because you hear about this all the time, these things happen. I asked them, “Are you for real?” One way of describing it is like the movie, The Twilight Zone. As I was showing them the policies on paper, they were telling me, “No, this is not what it says.” It was just unreal. I just couldn’t comprehend that they could not see what was in black in white right in front of them. It was a strange feeling. It was like this is not for real, these guys have got to be kidding.

Why did you grant the request of the son of a deceased veteran to present the blessing at his father’s graveside presentation, despite having been told by your supervisor to refrain from doing so?

Well, in one of the discussions I had with my supervisor—he would say it was an argument, I would say it was a discussion—we agreed that if anyone showed a religious preference, I would provide the blessing. By the family asking me specifically to offer it, that showed a religious preference, and it was complete in my mind. Initially, I was not going to present the flag or say it, but when the family came over to me and requested it, I told my partner that I was going to present the flag and say the blessing. That’s what compelled me to do it.

How did it make you feel when you were fired for doing your job (simply following military protocol)?

Barbara Cubbage: I was at work. He called me around noon and I asked, “Where are you?” He said, “Home, and that’s the good news. The bad news is that I was let go.” I could feel my heart fall, because he has been through so much as it is. A few days before, Pat told me he had been called to the carpet for saying “God bless you.” I couldn’t believe it. People are getting suspended for coming in under the influence and he gets fired? I couldn’t comprehend it. It was a shock to me. At first I thought he was joking. It was unbelievable to me. It was so unfair.

PC: My reaction was that I was shocked. I said to the supervisor, “You mean to tell me you have guys who will stand in a chapel and curse and are very disrespectful, and you are going to fire me because I said ‘God bless you?’” And he simply said, “Yes.”

How did you first find out about The Rutherford Institute?

PC: Actually, I heard about it from the reporter who did the story on me. He had called me and said that there were a half-dozen agencies that had called and wanted to represent me. I had already contacted the American Center for Law and Justice.

BC: When it first happened, the people at work suggested that Pat call the ACLJ. He did, but they said they couldn’t do anything. They said that they did write a letter to the New Jersey Honor Guard and they never got a response back after a certain amount of time. They wrote a letter to us saying they did not get a response back and they dropped it.

PC: They had dropped it, so I relayed that to the news reporter. He said, “Look, I cannot recommend anybody, but I will tell you that The Rutherford Institute has one of the highest reputations in the country, and I know people that went to them and were very satisfied.” I said, “Well, I’ll give it a shot.” I was really surprised by how professional, efficient and expedient you guys were. I was interviewed by FOX, and when I said, “Rutherford” the reporter said, “John Whitehead. You’ve got one of the best attorneys in the country.” I told him, “I’m glad you said that,” and I started speaking to people at our church, the senior pastors—they all knew about Rutherford.

How would you describe The Rutherford Institute’s efforts to support your rights—rights in the workplace as well as the right to freely exercise your religious views?

BC: You have really helped us through this rough time.

PC: I am very content and very happy. But that’s God’s hand. When I left my job, I was very polite. My supervisor said, “Today you are done, you leave at the end of the day.” I said, “Well, I might as well go home now. Thank you.” The guy who had initiated the complaint, said to me, “Well, you’re a good guy to work with, but I told you not to say that.” I said, “You don’t understand, you are not fighting me, you're fighting God. You have got to understand that He is always in control.” He laughed and I walked out, but I do not see him laughing now.

This past spring, more than 10,000 people participated in The Rutherford Institute’s petition campaign on your behalf (addressed to President Bush and Congress). How has the support of TRI and so many committed individuals affected you and your family?

PC: Well, I found out about the petition from guys in the National Guard. They called me up and one guy said, “I don’t agree with your views a lot, and I know you are very religious (I’m a Christian—I do not push my views on anyone), but what they did was wrong and I signed a petition.” I said, “Well, thank you, what petition?” He said, “Rutherford—it’s on the Internet. All the guys were talking about it, so I went on the Internet and we all signed.” So, I went on the Internet to see what they were talking about, and my son, who was stationed in Italy at the time, called and said guys over there were signing the petition too. He said it was all over the military.

Yes, I am amazed, and with the electronic world now, it’s a good way of getting things up and running.

Barbara emailed me and said that I was on the Presidential prayer calendar.

BC: I get the presidential prayer letter every month emailed to me at work. It’s about how to pray for the president and his cabinet—praying for things that are going on. I opened it up in March or February, and all of the sudden, there it was: “Honor Guard Gets Fired.” He was on this prayer list. I couldn’t believe it, even the president knew about it.

What are your plans now?

PC: Well, I was temporarily employed helping someone out in Philadelphia in local politics, which was good, because it kept me busy. But I’m still looking for something. I’m a former police officer, still young enough. Some of the positions that I have applied for, when they ask me if I have been fired, I have to answer ‘yes.’ If I say ‘no,’ and they call someone from New Jersey, who says I was fired, well, then I am a liar. I have a memo to take to interviews that the supervisor gave me saying that I was being terminated for saying “God bless you.” Sometimes, I’ll bring in a newspaper article. I was at an interview the other day, and the boss knew me from the Philadelphia Police Department and said, “I would vouch for this guy any day of the week,” and he asked me about the honor guard situation. I told him, and he said to “disregard that, don’t worry about that,” so there are some procedures I have to follow and if I can get that taken care of then I have a good opportunity with that company.

But yes, I am still looking right now. Barbara and I are in the process of organizing. We want to get rid of the house together and put it up for sale. All of the kids are gone. We are looking to relocate.

How would you recommend TRI to other individuals who are in need of assistance?

BC: As far as I am concerned, if I see anyone in need of help in relation to discrimination, the first words out of my mouth would be “The Rutherford Institute.” I would not even hesitate. You all have been very wonderful.

PC: Well I mentioned you on FOX, on 35 radio stations, every newspaper that called me up. Everybody I speak to, I tell them how Rutherford came out of nowhere for me. How, when I was trying to explain things to people that were procedures in writing, and they refused to accept it, I contacted Rutherford. And now, everybody wants to say, “Why did you get them? You did not need them.” Anytime something comes up I recommend Rutherford right away. In fact, sometimes I see things on the Internet and I will send a response suggesting that they use Rutherford.

I have been in law enforcement for sometime, dealt with a lot of attorneys, but I was impressed with the quick response of Rutherford. Not only quick, but knowledgeable. I can only describe them as Crusaders.